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Archiver > GEN-MEDIEVAL > 2004-04 > 1081032688


From: Doug McDonald <>
Subject: Re: POSSIBLE GATEWAY: FROM AFRICA TO EUROPE
Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2004 16:51:28 -0600
References: <c57e4f24.0403141731.5b931209@posting.google.com> <Yfqac.16754$Ku3.7324@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com> <7004aa4b.0403311402.37df8950@posting.google.com> <BAIac.30928$0d.25045@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com> <7004aa4b.0404010237.6708eb70@posting.google.com> <406BE67B.1020104@interfold.com> <7004aa4b.0404011411.797b638@posting.google.com> <406C9A90.B64BDFE0@scs.uiuc.edu> <7004aa4b.0404021653.cd38565@posting.google.com> <406E4EAD.4020207@interfold.com> <7004aa4b.0404031410.37aa9a31@posting.google.com>


Shawn Potter wrote:

>
> According to your argument, we cannot draw any conclusions about
> genealogy. If you really believe that, why do you spend time on the
> subject. Wouldn't a more rational--and honest--approach be to avoid
> making unsupportable declarations?


Unsupported and unsupportable are different things.

Suppose I put out three statements

"I am a male line descendant of Colla"
"I am a male line descendant of Somerled".
"I am a descendant of Somerled".


How are these supported? How would they have been supported
10 years ago?

Take the third one. I have a solid paper trail backwards
through my great grandfather Reddin McDonald, who married
Caroline Matilda Jordan Rose, to the immigrant the Rev. Robert Rose,
to Somerled, through the Roses of Bellivat and Kilravock as
well as Grant of Ballindalloch, numerous lines. This is paper proof.

However, I have no paper trail back from Reddin McDonald.
Ten years ago any claim to a male line from Somerled to me
would be fanciful, unsupported, and, by the standards of the time,
unsupportable. The only evidence would have been my name ...
and anybody could have just "adopted" it.

But today, in 2004, I do in fact now have support. This is not
absolute proof, but it is support, and is proof of a male line
relation to
him, if not actual decent from him. This comes from a mechanism that
was
not available 10 years ago, DNA. My DNA matches, apparently, the
current Lord McDonald, though this is hearsay, and is verified well
within the expected mutation rate of that of the chiefs of all the
branches of the Clan Donald, (including MacAllister) as well as the
MacDougalls. And this is a
haplogroup that is uncommon in Scotland, indicative of Viking
rather than Celtic descent. The haplotype within the haplogroup is
not terribly uncommon in northern Scotland, and though it exists
in England, it is indeed very uncommon there, and it to date has
not been found in Norway, Russia, Ukraine, or Pakistan. This
haplogroup becomes increasingly common as you go along that list,
being actually over 50% among Kashmiri Moslems. The clan chiefs and
Lord
McDonald all have perfectly good paper trails to Somerled. Their
proof is as good as it gets, especially since the DNA evidence is
truly dramatic proof that there was no (outside the line, of course
...
there could be "wrong brothers" there) funny business in the
bedroom.
We are left, of course, with the possibility that I am not his
descendant,
but only a descendant of a cousin. But it is no longer
"unsupportable".

Now consider my claim to be a male line descendant of Colla.
Somerled
has that claim attached to him. But his male line paper trail has
some lacunae, serious lacunae, fairly close to him ... and then
evaporates into myth. This claim is currently absolutely
unsupportable.
It is so bad that it probably actually is unsupportable, mythical or
no.
At least today, DNA or no. (Actually, even if he had existed, Colla
would have been a different, Celtic, haplogroup.)

Doug

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