Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2003-11 > 1067736955

From: David Faux <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] R1b, Surnames, and Ancient Origins
Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 17:35:55 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <010401c3a0da$b698ae80$f639d2cc@OFFICE1>

Hello Dave:

Hopefully you have mined all the databases and the research papers to the fullest extent.

Clearly the evidence would suggest that you are of Norwegian, Danish or Anglo - Saxon ancestry (where haplogroup I is found in abundance). Therein lies the rub. Only R1a1, according to respected researchers is entirely diagnostic in the British Isles (of Norwegian, west coast, Viking heritage). At least you do not have the same uphill path ahead of you that I faced. Since the Normans were a heterogeneous lot, it is challenging to say with any certainty that one's ancestor came in 1066 to the shores of England - but considering the data you have to hand, I would think that this is a very definite possiblity. Again, I would dearly love to see your matches in the FTDNA Haplogroup database (if you had the testing done by this firm). There will be clues galore, some subtle, and some "in your face". Certainly, according to the available historical research, Wiltshire seems to have been spared any direct contact of Danish Vikings (and, many would argue, Anglo - Saxons). This
geographical fact - if it can be demonstrated that your ancestors resided here since the days when surnames were adopted, would perhaps signal a Norman ancestry. My ancestral town is Worlingham, Suffolk in the 1300s - certainly an area that was over run by the Danish Viking invaders (part of the Danelaw). Still, the available evidence points to a Norman of Norwegian extraction. The fact that the majority of Scandanavians in Normandy at the time of the "invasion" of 1066 were, generations ago, largely Danish is noteworthy - but I will go with the DNA evidence for now. When more branches of my family are tested I may have to look more carefully at the "Danish hypothesis".

In summary, the facts in relation to your case do point toward a Norman connection - but the Danish Viking and Anglo - Saxon hypotheses cannot yet be ruled out. Once you methodically go through all the databases and the research papers relating to European Y-DNA you will be in a much better position to stand your ground and adopt a strong, perhaps Norman, hypothesis - perhaps you have already done this.

All the very best of luck,

David F.

David Willis <> wrote:

I have been trying to figure out where my English Willis ancestors came
from, and I think they may also have come to England from Normandy. My
thinking is based on the following three points.

(1) Y-chromosome. Mine is Haplogroup I (as in Idaho), which indicates
Scandinavian deep ancestry. This does not require the deep level of
analysis that you had to do, which seems convincing.

(2) The name "Willis" (Willy's son) derives from the name William (as in
William the Conqueror). Seems like flimsy evidence, but at least it is
something. In your case, you have the Norman name "Faux."

(3) My Willis line has been traced to rural Wiltshire, England, mid-1500's.
Wiltshire is in the southern part of England. I recall a note you posted
some time back where you described a visit you conducted to your ancestral
town in England. Where was it located in England?

I would welcome comments or suggestions on this from you or anyone on this

Dave Willis

Dr. David K. Faux, P.O. Box 192, Seal Beach, CA, 90740, USA

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