Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2003-11 > 1068425771

From: David Faux <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Celtic - Pictish Haplogroups in Shetland
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2003 16:56:15 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <017601c3a706$672f6eb0$589eddcb@Grant>

Hello Grant:

How unusual - not to know if you are I or G! I do hope that the SNP testing clears up the mystery, and that perhaps you can post something about the matter to the Rootsweb List since I suspect that there would be considerable interest in the matter.

To date, not only have I not found any G among my Shetland participants, but no I. I expected very low levels based on one published database and an unpublished database, I suspect that as my sample size increases (the number of particpants is starting to increase at a very respectable rate) the "Is" should start to make an appearance. It does not seem, however, that I should expect many (any?) G haplogroup participants. If anything, there will likely be more with a Q haplotype (based on the unpublished database) - and this will need a lot of explaining (I am searching for one at present).

Yes, we must keep in touch,

With best regards,


Palden <> wrote:

Good to hear from you!

I have looked at your web-page, very good.

You mention G in terms of 20% in Scotland. We are not seeing those numbers to date, fingers crossed.

Something from my side. The Irish Clans tested me as HgG, via SNP's, but FamilyTree have me at 'HgI', based on my STR's.

FTDNA is now testing my SNP's.

I believe other FamilyTree testee's who were thought of as HgI will also test G*, via SNP's, as this Haplogroup is diverse in its spread of STR's, and this is what is seen in native Gaelic Ulster Clans.

What I see so far in terms of the Scottish project is a possible 5% of G. I will not go no record as yet, as I can not firmly establish the parameters of variance in G and it may be that I and G share many similarities which will only be confirmed via SNP tests.

I have an oral tradition of Gaelic descent this is supported by my Y-DNA.

Keep in contact and all the best for the Shetland Project.

Grant South.

----- Original Message -----
From: David Faux
Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2003 5:07 AM
Subject: Re: [DNA] Celtic - Pictish Haplogroups in Shetland

Hello Grant:

This R1b + G is very fascinating - especially in trying to predict what a Pictish DNA signature from the Shetland Islands would "look like". To the best of my knowedge, no one has ever found an individual with haplogroup G in Shetland (and if they did my first suspicion would be that it relates to the Scottish immigration post 1468). None the less, thanks to your e-mail I will be alert to the potential meaning of any G haplotypes located in the course of my study.

My focus has also shifted to haplogroup Q (Inuit?) which has been found in one unpublished study of Shetland haplogroups. The numbers are high and may reflect a sampling bias, but none the less, no one to date has even aluded to an Inuit (Eskimo) contribution to the Shetland gene pool. There is so much to be learned - I just need to encourage more participants to step forward. So far, however, the participation rate is better than expected - as can be seen at:

Thanks to all who have given me assistance. Already the heritage of the Shetland Islands will need to be re-written to reflect the DNA findings.

David F.

Dear David,

My 1 in 5 is in relation to 1 HgG in 5 native Irish Clansmen in Ulster, [1 G to every 4 R1b].

In terms of Picts I believe them to be the Proto-Celtic R1b, not the post Celtic wave R1b. We may find them in terms of further subclades of R1b.

I believe that if Pictish descent is to be found it may be seen in the mtDNA of Shetland.

What is their haplogroup?. And does it match with the mtDNA of known Pictish settlement in Scotland, such as Moray. Further a Clan with a Pictish oral tradition such as the MacNaughton's would be an insight into a possible Y-Line signature.

The MacNaughton Chief lives in Antrim his family have been there since 1580, did I remember to send you his address?

Dr. David K. Faux, P.O. Box 192, Seal Beach, CA, 90740, USA

To join and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to:

To join and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to:

Dr. David K. Faux, P.O. Box 192, Seal Beach, CA, 90740, USA

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