GENEALOGY-DNA-L ArchivesArchiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-08 > 1155691154
Subject: Re: [DNA] Re: The search for Dalriadan genes-futile?
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:19:14 EDT
In a message dated 8/15/2006 2:43:48 P.M. Central Standard Time,
Regardless, the main conclusion is that we cannot
pinpoint Irish Dalriada descended individuals in
Ireland today on the basis of surnames. Consequently,
how can we identify Irish/ Dalriadan element in the
DNA of Scottish clans and the wider Scottish
population if we have nothing relevant to compare it
to in Ireland. It may (in terms of male lineages) be
one of those cases where the original Doner lineages
no longer exist but their descendants live on in
One possibility might be to check Erainn DNA in other parts of Ireland,
mostly notably the O'Driscoll and O'Shea septs of southern Ireland, both of
whom have clan DNA projects on the internet. This of course is based on O
Rahilly's theory that the Dal Fiatach and the Dal Riata were Erainn, the same as
the Erainn of the south.
I've tried this myself and the results are inconclusive (to me anyway).
The DNA of the clans said to descend from the Erainn of the south of Ireland
do not seem much different than the type Ken Nordtfeldt identified as
"southern Irish" on his web site, which others think correlates with the Eoghanachta
of Munster (O'Sullivan, McCarthy, etc.). And when compared to his Scottish
modals there doesn't seem to be any simple correlation either.
Perhaps others more knowledgeable about DNA analysis could give this a
shot themselves and see what they think. There are lots of O'Sullivan and
McCarthy DNA samples in the Trinity spreadsheet.
O Rahilly may have been wrong about a lot of things. One thing he wasn't
wrong about though were the Airgialla. Their DNA (Maguire, McMahon,
O'Hanlon) does not match the Ui Neill or NW Irish modal, nor does it match each other
very well. It seems the myth of the Three Collas is just another artificial
legend linking unrelated clans or septs in the northern midlands of Ireland.
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