Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2006-09 > 1159182786

From: John Cartmell <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Roman genetic footprints
Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 12:17:30 +0100
References: <><013901c6e090$8da08ea0$6401a8c0@Precision360>
In-Reply-To: <013901c6e090$8da08ea0$6401a8c0@Precision360>

On 25 Sep, Lawrence Mayka <> wrote:
> > From:
> > [mailto:] On Behalf Of John Cartmell
> > I'm J2 (ZENKY at YSearch). Back to 1540 (and probably
> > earlier) the paper records show that my paternal line is from
> > the area where many (maybe thousands) of Sarmatians were
> > known to have settled in what is now England.
> >
> > Can anyone show that I could not be descended from Sarmatian stock?
> >
> > Can anyone show that I'm less likely to be of Sarmatian stock
> > than non-Sarmatian Roman?

> Offhand, the strongest argument against Sarmatian ancestry is that of
> genetic distance. Under your hypothesis, we would expect the Sarmatian
> diaspora in other countries to be at least 1600 years away from you.

Assume 1800 years. It's fairly well dated to 175CE.

> Looking at your neighbors at 37 markers on Ysearch, this is what I see:

> 1) G2PE5 and TM6HD are only 7 away from you, but are both from Lancashire,
> England. Perhaps they distantly share your heritage.

So what would be the likely range of dates at which the three of us may merge?

> 2) Almost all other entries, including those from other countries, are at
> least 10 away from you, and appear to be the tail of the curve. This is not
> inconsistent with a 1600-year separation.

> 3) But we have one glaring exception: DMAVZ from the Czech Republic. He is
> only 7 away from you. He does not appear to be the tail of a curve, but
> rather a genuine distant relation.

> DMAVZ does not, alone, invalidate your claim to Sarmatian ancestry; but he
> weakens it. If his ancestor and yours actually parted ways 1600 years ago,
> is it likely that he and you would be only a genetic distance of 7 apart?
> Otherwise, if he is a distant relation, how did he get to the Czech Republic
> from England?

Perhaps I need to ask him? ;-)

> It is instructive to look at DMAVZ's own near neighbors at 37 markers on
> Ysearch. Most of his neighbors less than 10 away are English; but he, too,
> has an interesting exception: 87z46, from Poznan in Poland. One could argue
> that 87z46 is simply the tail of a central European curve, since Germans are
> 10-11 away from DMAVZ. Nevertheless, one wonders...

John Cartmelljohn@ followed by 0845 006 8822
Qercus magazineFAX +44 (0)
Qercus - the best guide to RISC OS computing

This thread: