GENEALOGY-DNA-L Archives

Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2009-05 > 1243370162


From: "Joe Fox" <>
Subject: [DNA] revised TMRCA calcuations for the R-L21 results
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 13:37:45 -0700


It seems to me there is a group-think going on that says that if you find some descendants of L21 living on the Continent, then surely that's where L-21 originated and that they then moved to Britain. When you're talking 3000 years ago, however, couldn't there have well been migrations in the opposite direction? Global temperatures do move up and down over many years and I understand there was a mini ice-age during the Middle Ages. We know there were mass migrations of tribes southward around the year 476 D that overwhelmed the Roman Empire, for example.

This same observation goes for S26/L1.

Joe Fox
Lafayette, CA

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Janzen" <>
To:
Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 5:32:07 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: [DNA] revised TMRCA calcuations for the R-L21 results

Dear All,
At Rich Stevens' suggestion I just took another look at the R-L21
positive data at http://www.familytreedna.com/public/R-L21. I segregated
the results from this project into multiple subgroups and made TMRCA
estimates. The following are the results using Ken Nordtvedt's method after
removing the multi-copy markers using my TMRCA variance calculator:

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (Ireland) 3203 74 37
R1b-L21+ (Ireland) 3319 52 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (Scotland) 3388 28 37
R1b-L21+ (Scotland) 3252 19 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (Ireland & Scot.) 3297 102 37
R1b-L21+ (Ireland & Scot.) 3356 71 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (England) 3004 43 37
R1b-L21+ (England) 3156 27 77

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (Wales) 3012 10 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (England and Wales) 2980 53 37
R1b-L21+ (England and Wales) 3191 37 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (England, Wales, Ireland, Scotland) 3216 155 37
R1b-L21+ (England, Wales, Ireland, Scotland) 3326 108 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (western Europe) 2894 23 37
R1b-L21+ (western Europe) 3177 14 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (Scandinavia) 2607 10 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (Eastern Europe) 2794 4 37
R1b-L21+ (Eastern Europe) 2567 3 67

Project KN -M # of haplotypes # of markers
R1b-L21+ (w., s. and e. Europe and Scandinavia) 2999 39 37
R1b-L21+ (w., s. and e. Europe and Scandinavia) 3141 27 67


We now have twice as many L21+ haplotypes as we did when I ran
similar calculations in January (see
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/GENEALOGY-DNA/2009-01/12320854
33) and the results continue to suggest that L21 originated in the British
Isles, probably in Ireland or Scotland. We aren't seeing as much haplotype
diversity on the continent of Europe or in Scandinavia as we would expect to
find if L21 had originated somewhere in western Europe. It will be
interesting to see how things unfold as we get even more data.
Sincerely,
Tim Janzen



This thread: