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From: "Anatole Klyosov" <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] R-U152 and R-L21 on the European Continent
Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 18:51:51 -0500
References: <mailman.6002.1260226551.2086.genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com>


> From: "Lawrence Mayka" <>

> When M458 was announced, we were thus easily able to bracket its age. An
> interclade calculation between P vs. N types (both M458+) gave us roughly
> 3200 years as a lower bound, and an interclade calculation between P+N vs.
> K
> types (K is M458-) yielded roughly 4300 years as an upper bound--all using
> 67-marker haplotypes.

My comment:

In R-M458, there are two principal branches of haplotypes, named a
"Central-European branch" and a "Western Slavic branch", with TMRCAs of
2500+/-300 ybp and 2200+/-300 ybp, respectively (they are the same with 39-
and 21-marker haplotypes). With 67-marker haplotypes (for more extended
datasets) they are 2725+/-300 and 2575+/-300 ybp, respectively. The R-458
itself was formed 3900+/-300 ybp. Hence, it fits pretty well with you data,
Lawrence.

Those figures were published in today's issue of the Proceedings of the
Russian Academy of DNA Genealogy, along with a detailed analysis of the
Underhill et al (2009) series of haplotypes. Free download:

http://www.lulu.com/product/download/%d0%92%d0%b5%d1%81%d1%82%d0%bd%d0%b8%d0%ba-%d0%a0%d0%be%d1%81%d1%81%d0%b8%d0%b9%d1%81%d0%ba%d0%be%d0%b9-%d0%90%d0%ba%d0%b0%d0%b4%d0%b5%d0%bc%d0%b8%d0%b8-%d0%94%d0%9d%d0%9a-%d0%b3%d0%b5%d0%bd%d0%b5%d0%b0%d0%bb%d0%be%d0%b3%d0%b8%d0%b8-%e2%84%967-2009/6092348

In Russian, alas. Though, ancestral haplotypes and haplotype trees are
there.

Anatole Klyosov



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