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Archiver > HERBARZ > 2003-08 > 1059758960


From: "Richard Whitehall" <>
Subject: English Gentlemen
Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2003 13:29:20 -0400


David Zincavage writes:

"One good quotation supporting a debating position is all that is necessary.
..."



Ah-hem, EXCUSE ME, Mr. Zincavage, but I'll be the judge of that, if that's
OK with you.




David Zincavage continues:

"These lengthy strings of quotations, many irrelevant, do not help your
argument."


I'm not arguing. I'm clarifying. I'm sorry for pointing out that I found
your original bald assertion, "An English gentleman might be armigerous and
of an ancient family and still be considered a commoner.," made without any
authoritative support, to be wanting and misleading--unless I'm to presume
you're an authority of some sort. I don't feel comfortable doing that.

The English word "commoner" covers a lot of ground. You failed to make that
clear and impetuously lumped villeins and gentlemen together, although it's
common knowledge and authoritatively obvious English gentlemen are of
superior birth.



QUOTING:

"Nobiles sunt qui arma gentilitia antecessorum suorum proferre possunt
[pronunciation omitted]. Those persons are nobles who can produce the
family arms of their ancestors."

SOURCE:

James A. Ballentine, "LAW DICTIONARY WITH PRONUNCIATIONS" (Rochester, NEW
YORK: THE LAWYERS CO-OPERATIVE PUBLISHING COMPANY, 1948), page 872.



QUOTING:

"Nobilitas est duplex, superior et inferior. 2 Inst. 583. There are two
sorts of nobility, the higher and the lower."

SOURCE:

HENRY CAMPBELL BLACK, M.A., "A LAW DICTIONARY CONTAINING DEFINITIONS OF THE
TERMS AND PHRASES OF AMERICAN AND ENGLISH JURISPRUDENCE, ANCIENT AND MODERN
AND INCLUDING THE PRINCIPAL TERMS OF INTERNATIONAL, CONSTITUTIONAL,
ECCLESIASTICAL, AND COMMERCIAL LAW, AND MEDICAL JURISPRUDENCE, WITH A
COLLECTION OF LEGAL MAXIMS, NUMEROUS SELECT TITLES FROM THE ROMAN, MODERN
CIVIL, SCOTCH, FRENCH, SPANISH, AND MEXICAN LAW, AND OTHER FOREIGN SYSTEMS.
AND A TABLE OF ABBREVIATIONS" (Saint Paul, Minnesota: WEST PUBLISHING
COMPANY, 1910), page 820.


Cheerio,

richard whitehall

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